Hi Robyn, I can totally relate how you feel. I look fine, and because I was in so much pain I basically stopped eating I lost weight and everyone was telling me how great I look. What a contradiction. No one can realize how painful this is. Yes, this all began for me with dental work, and I wish every day I could take that day of my life back. The one thing that I have been looking into is something called NICO (its some type of a jaw infection) that might mimic symptoms of neuralgia. It seems to be not commonly known but is know more amongst holistic dentists. Iāve had the stabbing pains and the facial burning. So far Iām basically just trying to make it through the day at work, and then I go home and do nothing. I used to be really active and outgoing but not anymore.
Hi Robyn,
I too have had extensive dental work. I went to the dentist with mild pain and was told I need a root canal. I had more pain after the root canal and was sent to an endodontist at University of Pennsylvania Hospital in Phila.
She did two more root canals on same tooth (2 separate times). The 4th root was very hard to reach apparently.
My pain became worse and a different endodontist at same hospital did an apicoectomy. They cut through the gum and through the bone to get to the nerve from the root side.
My pain got even worse until it became so bad I brought it up with my neurologist (who I was seeing for nerve pain elsewhere) and he diagnosed me with TN in Jan. 2010. Heās not sure if I had it before or after all these procedures, but I can tell you I am 99.9 % sure it became excruciating after all the dental work. I have constant pain with several to many attacks of excruciating pain throughout the day.
Please let me know how you are making out. I hope things are better for you.
Eva
Hi Robyn,
I met with my neurologist for the first time last week. He told me that TN can in fact be caused by dental work. He showed me a chart of all of the facial nerves. All of your teeth are connected to a nerve, which is connected to another nerve, (I canāt remember exactly all of the nerves) but eventually everthing is connected to your trigeminal nerve. So if there is some type of damage to one of your nerves, it can affect your trigeminal nerve. He did say that every case is different, some people may have had an underylying condition, and some people have damage that starts farther back on their trigeminal nerve and was not related to their teeth. Its hard to tell, everyone is different, but it seems like it certainly is possible.
I definitely had dental work, a root canal where it felt like they had punctured thru the tooth and hit the mandibular nerve. Not only once, but a second time with a different doc, an endocronologist. This doc was so disturbed by my crying in agony he refused to treat me when I went back for another problem.
How is that for taking your oath seriously. He said to me, āI would not treat you even if I did think you had a problem because of the way you behaved in my office.ā
Iāve learned there are so many times where the medical community has let me down. Fortunately my psychiatrist is very supportive and actually told me that itās not about me, but itās about them. They are the ones misbehaving and not living up to their hippocratic oath. What do you do when you feel a needle in your nerve? try to maintain your composure? Hell, I screamed, it was so painful. Then, I cried. The anesthetic had worn off and the hose delivering the nitrous was kinked thus I was no longer under anesthesia. O, still makes me upset to this day, but yes, I continued to be treated for dental problems, until finally my dentist realized this was a neurological case. For the longest time, he said I had malocculsion. I went untreated because I had what he thought was malocculsion.
Once they speculated that I brushed my teeth too hard. Go figure. That probably last 2-3 years and I was taking Vicodan and/or Vicoprofen. I was frustrated and I wanted off these medicines. No one had introduced Neurontin or any other medication to me other than these narcotics. It wasnāt until I got into pain management they I tried tegretol, lyrica and every drug you can imagine.
Itās no wonder I lost a lot of friends who thought I was just a drug addict. Make me feel very sad. But Yes, it all started with a root canal.
I am almost 100% certain mine started with a root canal also. I had a root canal at a family dentist. My pain (worse than when I started) continued for 4 - 5 months. I was sent to an endodontist who did 2 more root canals on the same tooth (about 2 months apart). After no relief and worsening pain another endodontist at the same practice did an apicoectomy (a procedure where the tooth nerve is removed through an incision into the gum and bone). The pain never got better, only worse with every procedure!
I went back to the dentist and endodontist multiple times. The exams and x-rays found nothing wrong with my tooth and they could not explain why I was in excruciating pain ! No one even dared to suggest that the trigeminal nerve may be damaged or that I may have TN as a result of multiple invasive procedures ! The endodontist actually suggested that I need to be cut open all along my right upper gumline to check for anything wrong that canāt be seen on x-ray. I would have to be crazy to endure any more torture ! ! ! ! ! !
After over a year of pain, I told my neurologist what my pain felt like and he said my symptoms sound like TN.
I had an MRI of the brain which was normal, thank God. However, the neurologist said TN doesnāt necessarily show up on MRI. He started me on trileptal and vicodin, which make me sick and barely work. My pain still continues ! I am in pain every day, some days worse than others.
TN can absolutely start with a root canal or even other dental work !
Good luck to anyone out there who is experiencing this awful pain. I am thinking of and praying for all of us !
This is my story, too! I had root canal (on the opposite side) then a few weeks later, TN started. Also, my MRI showed no compression but my surgeon found the compression while performing my MVD. Iāve heard that MRIs are somewhat imperfect in that they can miss the area of compression.
Yes! Iāve had a lot of dental work done and each time my TN flares up!
My journey in pain began three weeks ago yesterday with a dental extraction. It was an upper premolar that had had a root canal done on it 3 1/2 years ago. The tooth never settled down. Always hurt a little. During July the pain increased. The week before I had it pulled it was very painful. My dentist and I had discussed over the years how the root might be cracked, but this would not show on an xray. The only way to know for sure was to pull it. So I put up with a toothache for 3 1/2 years until 3 weeks ago. Iāve traded that toothache for pain 100 fold. Iāve been seen by a neurologist who had given me the diagnosis of Atypical Facial Pain. So while Iām not TN, I am in pain. That NEVER stops. This is 3 weeks of AGONY. All of my top teeth feel like they are being pulled on and torqued. It hurts on the bridge of my nose like someone has whacked me with a baseball bat. My forehead hurts as does the top of my head and the back of my neck. Like Robyn, I too am an elementary teacher. Weāve had 7 days of school so far and Iāve only been there for 3 of them. How on earth can you teach with this much pain?
Chalkdusty,
I am sorry. Ask your neuro for an increase in meds or another medication. Keep trying. I hope one of them will help. And I would ask for an MRI just to make sure there isnāt a compression. There are several members who have had teeth pulled and really have TN. Your pain sounds like it may be atypical since your pain is pretty constant. Do you have any sharp, stabbing or electric like pain?
Liz
chalkdusty said:
My journey in pain began three weeks ago yesterday with a dental extraction. It was an upper premolar that had had a root canal done on it 3 1/2 years ago. The tooth never settled down. Always hurt a little. During July the pain increased. The week before I had it pulled it was very painful. My dentist and I had discussed over the years how the root might be cracked, but this would not show on an xray. The only way to know for sure was to pull it. So I put up with a toothache for 3 1/2 years until 3 weeks ago. Iāve traded that toothache for pain 100 fold. Iāve been seen by a neurologist who had given me the diagnosis of Atypical Facial Pain. So while Iām not TN, I am in pain. That NEVER stops. This is 3 weeks of AGONY. All of my top teeth feel like they are being pulled on and torqued. It hurts on the bridge of my nose like someone has whacked me with a baseball bat. My forehead hurts as does the top of my head and the back of my neck. Like Robyn, I too am an elementary teacher. Weāve had 7 days of school so far and Iāve only been there for 3 of them. How on earth can you teach with this much pain?
Liz, my pain is not stabbing or electric. It is absolutely constant, aching, crushing. The neurologist said it is not TN, but ATFP. He has not ordered an MRI, but I am going to call him tomorrow morning about the continued levels of pain. Iāll ask about the MRI as well.
Chalkdusty,
Let us know what your doctor tells you. I know that both TN and ATN are bad. I have mixed since a few months before my surgery. Iām a lot better since surgery. I canāt imagine life with either of them if I had to continue as I was before surgery. I am sorry you are in so much pain.
Liz
chalkdusty said:
Liz, my pain is not stabbing or electric. It is absolutely constant, aching, crushing. The neurologist said it is not TN, but ATFP. He has not ordered an MRI, but I am going to call him tomorrow morning about the continued levels of pain. Iāll ask about the MRI as well.
I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
In doing further research I found some information on āatypical odontalgiaā that seems to fit my situation. Starts with one tooth - either root canal or extraction- happens more often in women than men, and usually presents in the fourth decade of life.
Andy Rackerby said:
I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
chalkdusty,
trigeminal neuropathic pain can also present as an aching pain; being neither electric nor stabbing. i have this condition and my symptom is aching pain only.
atypical odontalgia is a murky condition under the umbrella of trigeminal nerve injury. itās a condition which requires trauma to the teeth. the pain it produces is still trigeminal neuropathic pain. practitioners are creating more problems by creating these fancy terms when they should be streamlining things to make patientsā diagnoses simpler and more concise.
the tooth extraction may have damaged your nerve. please contact your neurologist to begin medication as soon as possible. trigeminal neuropathic pain can be more difficult to treat, in my opinion, than TN because the mechanism of injury can be varied and the pain mechanisms can be different as well. sometimes it takes more than one medication to do the trick. i use an anti seizure and a tricyclic anti depressant together.
iām not a doctor, so speak to your own about what iāve said here.
good luck,
vesper
chalkdusty said:
In doing further research I found some information on āatypical odontalgiaā that seems to fit my situation. Starts with one tooth - either root canal or extraction- happens more often in women than men, and usually presents in the fourth decade of life.
Andy Rackerby said:I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
Vesper,
I have seen a neurologist. He diagnosed āatypical facial painā and prescribed amiltriptyline. It took a while , but it does seem to be helping now. Iām finally able to sleep and the daytime pain levels run from 3 to 6 instead of 7 to 9. I go back on the 24th so hopefully we can adjust some meds to keep the pain level lower during my work day. Iām an elementary level teacher so it is doubly important to me that I have a painfree day so the children have a good learning day.
vesper venustas said:
chalkdusty,
trigeminal neuropathic pain can also present as an aching pain; being neither electric nor stabbing. i have this condition and my symptom is aching pain only.
atypical odontalgia is a murky condition under the umbrella of trigeminal nerve injury. itās a condition which requires trauma to the teeth. the pain it produces is still trigeminal neuropathic pain. practitioners are creating more problems by creating these fancy terms when they should be streamlining things to make patientsā diagnoses simpler and more concise.
the tooth extraction may have damaged your nerve. please contact your neurologist to begin medication as soon as possible. trigeminal neuropathic pain can be more difficult to treat, in my opinion, than TN because the mechanism of injury can be varied and the pain mechanisms can be different as well. sometimes it takes more than one medication to do the trick. i use an anti seizure and a tricyclic anti depressant together.
iām not a doctor, so speak to your own about what iāve said here.
good luck,
vesper
chalkdusty said:In doing further research I found some information on āatypical odontalgiaā that seems to fit my situation. Starts with one tooth - either root canal or extraction- happens more often in women than men, and usually presents in the fourth decade of life.
Andy Rackerby said:I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
chalkdusty,
atypical facial pain is a catchall diagnosis when the answer is āi donāt know.ā it is frustrating because there is a biochemical reason for your pain, but science lacks the sophistication to tell you why. for now.
your medication is a tricyclic depressant also known an Elavil. Nortriptyline, or Pamelor, is a second generation of this type of drug which causes less side effects, most notably, cardiovascular effects such as high blood pressure and tachycardia (elevated heart rate). my suggestion to you is to monitor both of these vital signs while you continue to adjust your dosage; if they elevate to undesirable levels, talk to your neurologist about switching to Nortriptyline; it might be easier on your system.
again, iām not an MD; refer my notes with your neurologist, and see if he agrees.
take care,
vesper
chalkdusty said:
Vesper,
I have seen a neurologist. He diagnosed āatypical facial painā and prescribed amiltriptyline. It took a while , but it does seem to be helping now. Iām finally able to sleep and the daytime pain levels run from 3 to 6 instead of 7 to 9. I go back on the 24th so hopefully we can adjust some meds to keep the pain level lower during my work day. Iām an elementary level teacher so it is doubly important to me that I have a painfree day so the children have a good learning day.
vesper venustas said:chalkdusty,
trigeminal neuropathic pain can also present as an aching pain; being neither electric nor stabbing. i have this condition and my symptom is aching pain only.
atypical odontalgia is a murky condition under the umbrella of trigeminal nerve injury. itās a condition which requires trauma to the teeth. the pain it produces is still trigeminal neuropathic pain. practitioners are creating more problems by creating these fancy terms when they should be streamlining things to make patientsā diagnoses simpler and more concise.
the tooth extraction may have damaged your nerve. please contact your neurologist to begin medication as soon as possible. trigeminal neuropathic pain can be more difficult to treat, in my opinion, than TN because the mechanism of injury can be varied and the pain mechanisms can be different as well. sometimes it takes more than one medication to do the trick. i use an anti seizure and a tricyclic anti depressant together.
iām not a doctor, so speak to your own about what iāve said here.
good luck,
vesper
chalkdusty said:In doing further research I found some information on āatypical odontalgiaā that seems to fit my situation. Starts with one tooth - either root canal or extraction- happens more often in women than men, and usually presents in the fourth decade of life.
Andy Rackerby said:I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
Vesper,
Thanks for the information you posted. Iām on 25 mg at night. The neurologist wanted me to up that to 50 mg the second week. I tried it over the long weekend, but found that I could not get up put of bed in the morning. Took me over an hour of hitting the snooze button to finally wake up enough to get my feet on the floor. So I backed it back down to 25. I have several questions written down to ask him at my upcoming visit so Iāll be sure to ask about the other med. Thanks so much!
vesper venustas said:
chalkdusty,
atypical facial pain is a catchall diagnosis when the answer is āi donāt know.ā it is frustrating because there is a biochemical reason for your pain, but science lacks the sophistication to tell you why. for now.
your medication is a tricyclic depressant also known an Elavil. Nortriptyline, or Pamelor, is a second generation of this type of drug which causes less side effects, most notably, cardiovascular effects such as high blood pressure and tachycardia (elevated heart rate). my suggestion to you is to monitor both of these vital signs while you continue to adjust your dosage; if they elevate to undesirable levels, talk to your neurologist about switching to Nortriptyline; it might be easier on your system.
again, iām not an MD; refer my notes with your neurologist, and see if he agrees.
take care,
vesper
chalkdusty said:Vesper,
I have seen a neurologist. He diagnosed āatypical facial painā and prescribed amiltriptyline. It took a while , but it does seem to be helping now. Iām finally able to sleep and the daytime pain levels run from 3 to 6 instead of 7 to 9. I go back on the 24th so hopefully we can adjust some meds to keep the pain level lower during my work day. Iām an elementary level teacher so it is doubly important to me that I have a painfree day so the children have a good learning day.
vesper venustas said:chalkdusty,
trigeminal neuropathic pain can also present as an aching pain; being neither electric nor stabbing. i have this condition and my symptom is aching pain only.
atypical odontalgia is a murky condition under the umbrella of trigeminal nerve injury. itās a condition which requires trauma to the teeth. the pain it produces is still trigeminal neuropathic pain. practitioners are creating more problems by creating these fancy terms when they should be streamlining things to make patientsā diagnoses simpler and more concise.
the tooth extraction may have damaged your nerve. please contact your neurologist to begin medication as soon as possible. trigeminal neuropathic pain can be more difficult to treat, in my opinion, than TN because the mechanism of injury can be varied and the pain mechanisms can be different as well. sometimes it takes more than one medication to do the trick. i use an anti seizure and a tricyclic anti depressant together.
iām not a doctor, so speak to your own about what iāve said here.
good luck,
vesper
chalkdusty said:In doing further research I found some information on āatypical odontalgiaā that seems to fit my situation. Starts with one tooth - either root canal or extraction- happens more often in women than men, and usually presents in the fourth decade of life.
Andy Rackerby said:I just spoke to an individual that had TN as a result of dental work. Apparently you can have TN as a result of dentistry. Iād consult a neurosurgeon as to treatment as cause is atypical.
My understanding is that it isnt the dental work that causes the TN but the dental work can be a stimulus. In other words whatever causes you to have TN is there with or without the dental work but the dental work might make you feel the effects of the TN faster or stronger. I thought mine was started by dental work but really I had a congenital anomaly where my nerve and blood vessels were all intertwined. I dont think they know all of the causes of TN yet. Mine was easy to diagnose after the surgery but it took me 4 years to be diagnosed and put on meds because of my age.
Having been a member if the TNA (TN association) for years, Iāve read of stories where dental work was believed to caused/triggered the TN.
Same for trauma, (like a car accident), infection (tooth or gum)ā¦just so many known causes and probably a lot more of unknown causes.
I had a root canal too. Then I had TN. Iāve always felt the dentist damaged a nerve or something.